Title Pirates: How Scammers Use Quitclaim Deeds to Steal Homes

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[00:00:01] Bob: This week on The Perfect Scam.

[00:00:04] Dreama Bilby: Yes, you did lose something because you lose the feeling that your home is safe, you lose the sanctity of your home, the fact your emotional bond to it is forever crushed. You don't feel like taking your grandchildren back there or your friends because they've heard this story now for a year, and you're upset all the time, so you lose a lot when this happens to you.

[00:00:27] Larry Bilby: It's literally the worst thing can happen to you is lose your house this way. It's like a sinkhole. You don't even have the dirt, okay? And everything is gone.

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[00:00:39] Bob: Welcome back to The Perfect Scam. I'm your host, Bob Sullivan.

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[00:00:46] Bob: Today we're going to talk about pirates, home pirates anyway, or at least what a Florida State Attorney has called Title Pirates. What are they? I'll explain shortly, but I also promise you this episode comes with just a little bit of homework that you can do which only takes a few moments and it's free and, well after we're done here, I bet you're going to want to complete this homework assignment right away. Tampa homeowners Larry and Dreama Bilby learned the hard way what title pirates are recently when they noticed someone sneaking around their home as it was undergoing extensive repairs after it had been crushed by a tree. One disaster after another for this unlucky couple. Let's find out how Larry and Dreama got into this place in the first place before the pirates on the 4th of July 2018, there was a loud boom and not a fun kind.

[00:01:43] Larry Bilby: The tree looked perfectly green, but inside it was completely rotten. The termites were in there, and then on the 4th of July, a beautiful, quiet, no wind day, the darn thing fell from the neighbor's yard through our roof and really, the house was basically two stories, went right through it and uh, put so much wood in the yard you couldn't even see the river that we're on. It just, it's just a huge, huge tree.

[00:02:09] Dreama Bilby: It actually moved the whole house.

[00:02:11] Bob: Wow.

[00:02:11] Dreama Bilby: I, I was awake when it happened and I actually thought lightning had struck because it was a sunny day but you can hear lightning sometimes. And there was this crack and the whole house shifted and I said, oh my gosh, and I said, "Larry, you'd better look." And it was, it's just hard to describe what it looked like. That tree was huge. And inside the house.

[00:02:35] Bob: So with the tree inside the house, they have to move outside of the house while it gets repaired. I'm sure you've heard about home projects like this that go sideways. So there were the typical delays, and then there was COVID. So Larry and Dreama found themselves in the middle of a years' long odyssey.

[00:02:56] Dreama Bilby: Mostly it, the whole six years have been somewhat of a nightmare because we had, there were health issues that had occurred with Larry in between that held us up too.

[00:03:06] Bob: Somewhat of a nightmare, and that seems like an understatement, but they keep a close eye on the project from their temporary apartment a few minutes away. They drive by frequently, watch the cameras they have set up on the property, then finally just last year the home is just about ready to be moved back into and then they notice something odd on their cameras.

[00:03:29] Dreama Bilby: I told Larry one night, I said, "Oh, this dog keeps triggering the camera," because the camera comes through to my phone, and this one night, here's this couple. I said, I bet they're looking for that dog that keeps triggering the camera at night. But then the next day they were at the house and I said to Larry, "This is not good. They're not looking for a dog." And he took over. Said, this is not good.

[00:03:54] Bob: Hmm.

[00:03:55] Larry Bilby: Well they, they were, they were looking around the shrubbery at the front door and, and knowing at that point in time looking for a key, and that's when I said, ooh, there's no dog in the shrubbery. So this doesn't look good.

[00:04:08] Bob: It's the worst fear for anyone with a home they can't be in 24/7. Prowlers looking for a way in obviously aware the owners are away. The Bilby's file a report with the police right away but police can only do so much, and on the 13th of February, during the daytime, that couple is back. So Larry calls the neighbors. And when confronted, this mystery couple has what could have sounded like a reasonable explanation for the neighbor.

[00:04:39] Larry Bilby: I said, what, what are they saying? They said we bought the house; we're your new neighbors. And he says, and he said, "Larry's sick." So he knew my name.

[00:04:46] Bob: They bought the house? They sound believable enough even know some of the basics about the property. And if Larry wasn't friendly with his neighbor, he might have believed their story. He didn't, and so this mysterious couple slinks away.

[00:05:01] Larry Bilby: They knew my name, okay. Which I said anyway that's really not a good sign that he knew my name. That means he knows who has the title of the property. He has all the, he could possibly have taken it off the posted work permit, you know, on one of the windows, but I don't know where. And so that was very disturbing, but at least I felt good that the neighbor ran him off.

[00:05:22] Bob: But that confrontation is even more disturbing than the video they'd watched earlier. So Dreama and Larry sweep into action. There's a new service in Florida and other states too that Larry and Dreama sign up for.

[00:05:39] Dreama Bilby: Well, with the people coming up to the house the way they did and Larry and I talking about this did not look good, Larry looked into it and realized that we could sign up for the fraud alert through the clerk of the court which was something that had been available but we weren't always aware of that, but it had been made available by our governor in the state of Florida free to every clerk of the court. So everyone in the state of Florida could do this. And so we went ahead and took advantage of it.

[00:06:11] Bob: This free service notifies owners if there's any change to the property records at the county clerk's office. And it's a good thing they signed up.

[00:06:20] Dreama Bilby: It was probably two days after and I called Larry at work and I said, "This is not good. We have an alert," and I said, "And the alert says the house is not in our name." And Larry came straight home.

[00:06:32] Bob: Their home, the one split by a tree, the one they spent six years repairing, waiting to move back into, well it's no longer in their name? Dreama is overwhelmed.

[00:06:45] Dreama Bilby: I was so upset and disturbed by the whole thing that actually I was in tears. I was crying. I was, I can't believe this. Our house is not in our name and I had actually called to the clerk's office and when I did call, well it's a number on there about property fraud, and they said, “The house is in (beep)." And I'm like, it's in what? You're, you're almost in shock. You just can't even imagine this has happened. So Larry saw someone very upset and really not even sure of what do we do next.

[00:07:23] Bob: Since they'd already filed a police report, Larry and Dreama don't go to the clerk's office first, they head right to the police. But the police, they don't know what to do.

[00:07:35] Larry Bilby: Well actually, I left work, went right to the police precinct that covers that area and tried to get an audience with the shift commander, or anybody that could file a criminal complaint. Believe it or not, there's nobody in the entire precinct that could file a criminal complaint. I said, I told my wife, "Oh my God, we got, we're in a lot of trouble now." And that took us back to the clerk of the court, okay, and we're in the elevator that's going to the clerk of the court...

[00:08:00] Bob: At the county clerk's office, finally they have some luck, well more than luck, they find some empathy, but not right away.

[00:08:10] Dreama Bilby: Well, when we got down to the courthouse, went to several different areas of the courthouse asking where would we go to find out about property fraud? No one knew what we were talking about. And that's really scary. That's part of this that's frightening because we asked sheriff's officers, we asked different people in the court, and they would send us around and around. Well it turned out someone sent us to the clerk of the court's office and we asked the sheriff at the door, where would we go. He said, "Well I'm really not sure." So we got in the elevator and we were, I was crying. Very upset. I knew our house was not in our name, and I'm talking to Larry about it and this lovely woman that was standing there in the elevator with us, she said, "I'm not really listening in, but is this what's happened and what you're looking for?" So she described what she had overheard from us, our situation with the deed being changed. And we said yes. She goes, "Come with me. I'm going to help you."

[00:09:06] Bob: Come with me, I'm going to help you. For Dreama, these words are heaven-sent.

[00:09:13] Dreama Bilby: And she brought in um, the lady they call the head abstracter, and the clerk of the court. And she's really the one who assuaged my fears that she said, "We're going to help you through this." Thank heavens for her, right, Larry?

[00:09:27] Larry Bilby: Oh yes.

[00:09:29] Bob: So this good Samaritan brings Larry and Dreama into a back office, the head abstracter, and there they get the paperwork help they need.

[00:09:38] Larry Bilby: Well actually, it was just a little ante room. We really weren't in the office where the files are. They're, most of them are held in the cloud, quite frankly. And these people just met us in a little anteroom there. And as Dreama was very upset and they were very consoling and very, very helpful.

[00:09:56] Bob: It turns out that on February 14th, yes, Valentine's Day, just a day after Larry and Dreama spotted that couple on their cameras and called the neighbors, remember it was them who claimed that they had bought the house. Well, the next day someone had initiated a title transfer on the home using what's called a quitclaim deed. Much more about that kind of deed later. But this can't be a coincidence. As Larry says, the deed was still in transit, so the clerk was able to stop that -- thank goodness, because only a few days later the paperwork problem could have become much worse and much more expensive. But there's still another problem. This couple is still out there. The clerk encourages Larry and Dreama to help find them.

[00:10:42] Larry Bilby: Cause they, they said, the police at the time, if you get the opportunity, catch these people. They said this happens than more people can realize. We have people here that are trying to get their home back for years and they're never going to get it back, okay? And said, this is a terrible crime, but it's something that very few people understand and comprehend, including our own police department, quite frankly.

[00:11:04] Bob: So this mysterious couple Larry and Dreama have seen on their security cameras, they're still on the loose, and no one knows what to do about them. But now Larry and Dreama have an advantage. However these people are, they don't know that their plan to swap the title has been blocked, and sure enough, just a short while later they go back to the house.

[00:11:26] Larry Bilby: They tried to break in the house at night, and we got our cameras tripped off, the cops came, and I went there and uh, one window was unlocked and they were just, they were just about to set the audible alarm off as well.

[00:11:41] Bob: The mysterious couple is long gone when the police arrive, and police don't really understand what Larry tells them about the quitclaim deed and the house theft. So they write up the incident as trespassing and everyone leaves. But Larry is barely back in the home before...

[00:11:59] Dreama Bilby: We relocked it, re-alarmed it. Larry it, it wasn't even an hour and I said, "They're back." I mean I'm just looking at my phone going...

[00:12:08] Bob: Wow! You're kidding me. An hour later they came back.

[00:12:11] Dreama Bilby: Totally disturbed, I was just totally disturbed. They pulled right back up, they have their flashlight out, and they're back around the home, so I'm on the phone to the police again. They're back.

[00:12:23] Bob: Before anyone can get to the house, this couple is gone again. So Larry goes back over, re-arms the alarms, and well, as Dreama says, this is just the beginning. For the next several weeks this couple keeps showing up at the house over and over. One time, the neighbor calls the cops and they get there in time to confront the woman. This confrontation is captured on police bodycam. Here's part of that audio beginning with the office asking the suspicious woman some questions.

[00:12:54] (clip)

Police: What's going on? What brings you here?

Woman: Uh, well it's my property. I've been having problems with the previous owner.

Police: It's your property?

Woman: Yes.

Police: You're renting it?

Woman: No, I, I own it. And they're under the impression that...

(voice in background)

Police: Yep, code 6, because I've been speaking to the owner here for a while, and I talked to him last week, like inside the house. Do you have keys to the property?

Woman: Um, no. He won't give me the key. I've been having a really bad legal problem with him right now.

Police: Are you, are you on a lease?

Woman: Uh, no, but I'm on the current deed.

Police: Where is the deed?

Woman: Uh, I believe I have a copy in the car.

Police: So like I said, I, I was here about two weeks ago and I walked through the property with the owner who, who is an older gentleman, obviously not you, so I have some familiarization with the house. So he had a key. He's not renting it to anybody right now unless something's changed in the last 10 days. So have...

(police radio)

Police: ... You're saying that you, you're on the deed.

Woman: Well yeah, we had an agreement years ago. We've been having problems; he doesn't want to honor it all of a sudden.

Police: Who's he?

Woman: Um, the previous owner, Larry.

Police: What's his name? What's his name?

Woman: Larry.

Police: Larry what?

Woman: Bilby.

Police: Larry Bilby?

[00:14:07] Bob: You can tell police are skeptical of her claims, but even though she's caught with some of Larry's mail in her hands, police don't feel they have enough information to arrest her, yet. So they let her go and the crazy appearances go on. It now becomes clear that whoever this person is, she's been using Larry and Dreama's address to set up a new identity. She gets a driver's license using their address.

[00:14:34] Bob: So if I'm not mistaken, this goes on and on and on and they have groceries delivered, they steal mail. This goes on for weeks, right?

[00:14:40] Larry Bilby: Oh weeks, yeah. They were, what they're trying again, it's not, these people were very adept at squatting.

[00:14:46] Bob: But also, you know you're just continually seeing these people show up at the building. You keep calling the police, they keep, what, the police keep coming and, and missing them. This seems just crazy to me.

[00:14:55] Dreama Bilby: It was crazy. They, they had groceries delivered. I said to my husband, I said, "There's a whole thing of groceries being delivered." And then the groceries disappear, but they disappear away from the camera, so they knew where the cameras were, they, they, they figured that out, and the mail, I would see her at night take the mail, and go to get in their car and looking through the mail. So I did go and have the mail held because I had to do something.

[00:15:23] Bob: Yeah, sure.

[00:15:23] Dreama Bilby: I mean it was like what else is going to happen? Food's getting delivered there at night, and then it's getting picked up. So they totally, they just acted as if they lived there doing that. I stayed up every night for weeks, for a month, all night with my phone just waiting for it to be triggered, because I knew they would be back, or I didn't, I didn't know when, but I knew they'd be back.

[00:15:47] Bob: But finally, a detective is assigned to the case and several weeks into this crazy situation, a warrant is issued for their arrest and police pull over Michelle Cherry and Victor Rodriguez during a traffic stop. And by then, Larry has figured out this couple are also wanted for similar title home thefts in other parts of Florida, so soon this couple is facing seven felony charges. Quote, "Tampa has a history of pirates since 1904, these people are title pirates," said Hillsborough State Attorney, Susie Lopez. The case against them is fairly iron-clad. There's even video from the clerk's office when they filed the fraudulent quitclaim deed.

[00:16:29] Dreama Bilby: And so we begged, please hold these videos. You have to do it. And they did. And that was a real big help for us.

[00:16:39] Bob: Very important evidence, I'm sure.

[00:16:40] Dreama Bilby: We, when we went down and asked them, "Were you able to keep these videos? Were you able to hold them?" And the woman who's in charge there, she said, "Yes, we were able to hold them." And I said, "Well, can we see them?" And she said, "No, because they're part of an investigation now." She said, "But I looked at them." And I said, "Well let me describe to you what they look like and what they were wearing." And she just, mouth agape. She said, "Really, you exactly described them, and they had the exact clothes on that you said they would." I said, "Yes, that's what they wore into my home and they keep wearing this every time they show up at my house."

[00:17:16] Bob: Just amazing.

[00:17:18] Dreama Bilby: Unbelievable.

[00:17:20] Bob: In early 2025, both Cherry and Rodriguez plead guilty. Dreama and Larry both testify at Cherry's sentencing hearing.

[00:17:28] Dreama Bilby: Well honestly, it was frightening. And when I went in that day, I was prepared to make a statement about the sentencing at the end of everything, but I wasn't prepared for the prosecutor to tell me, "I'm putting you on the stand first." And I said, "For what?" And I honestly, it made me just sick to my stomach. I thought I've never had to be in a courtroom, and here I am and I had to stand up and, and do the swearing in and her attorney tried to rattle me some, but the truth of the matter is, it's very dis--, I can't tell you the gut wrenching feeling that goes through you when this happens, and you have your home, your marital home that you raised your kids in and you, you have all your memories in, your furniture, your, your photos are there. And it, it was just an awful feeling. And I've had people say, "But you didn't lose your home." I said, "But yes, you did lose something because you lose the feeling that your home is safe, you lose the sanctity of your home, the fact your emotional bond to it is forever crushed. You don't feel like taking your grandchildren back there or your friends because they've heard this story now for a year, and you're upset all the time, so you lose a lot when this happens to you." And in that testimony, I shared that with the court. It, it's just a horrible feeling, and it's a horrible feeling to see someone, and I saw it from the police cameras, having someone stand there in front of my husband and say, "This is my home," and show a driver's license. You just, you just can't even imagine. So it was a terrible experience for me, and I cried. Of course I was very upset.

[00:19:09] Larry Bilby: It's literally the worst thing can happen to you is lose your house this way. It's like a sinkhole. You don't even have the dirt, okay? And everything is gone. At least in a hurricane, at least you have the dirt, okay? You have nothing when this happens.

[00:19:21] Bob: The judge sentences Cherry to 15 years in jail, the same sentence her partner-in-crime received earlier. Dreama and Larry are glad they've been put away for a while, but the entire incident now has them on a crusade to warn other people about title home theft.

[00:19:36] Dreama Bilby: Well, I just want to say that people don't, they don't realize that I've had people say to me, well it won't happen to me, or they'll say, my house is in a trust. It doesn't matter how your house is listed. People can still do this to you.

[00:19:51] Larry Bilby: They need to know that it can happen to anyone. They're, they're stealing tracts of land out there. People who've inherited tracts of land and they don't check on the tract of land, and they go check on it, there's a subdivision built there. The tract of land was stolen and they didn't know it. It can happen to anybody anywhere and it is happening to anybody anywhere. Don't think that you're immune to it, for some reason that you've got a debt on the house. That doesn't to be stopping them, okay, they can just get the HELOC on it.

[00:20:20] Dreama Bilby: And what really has to happen, if I may add, is that we, we hope our next push, we're like the PSA for property fraud and we don't want to be. This is not what we'd like to be doing, but yes, anyone could be a victim, and if the laws don't change then people will still be victims forever. And we have to get the laws changed. My, my feeling personally is that it should not be the person the home's given to that files that deed, it should be the giver of the property. So if I'm going to give my property to someone, I should have to be the one to record it in the clerk's office, not the person taking it. And I think that's just a big issue with it, but just one of many that we've talked about that the law has to change. Fortunately, in Florida we have, you know, a free clerk of the court notification, but many people aren't aware of it and don't take advantage of it. But all states don't have it. So...

[00:21:16] Bob: Yeah, yeah. That's a, it's a relatively new thing, I know, so.

[00:21:20] Dreama Bilby: Yes. So we definitely, definitely we need to change the law to protect us. I mean people work their whole life to own a home. It's the American Dream, and if it can be stolen that fast, that quickly without you knowing it, you have to wonder if it's worth having. It's very frightening to go through this.

[00:21:38] Bob: It's the American Dream, and it can be stolen that fast. And how can that be? Here to help us understand what's happening here and how you can protect yourself is Elizabeth Blosser. She's the Chief Strategy, Communications and Innovation Officer with the American Land Title Association which helps title companies that manage most residential real estate transfers in the US housing market. I began by asking her, what is a quitclaim deed?

[00:22:07] Bob: It's funny, it sounds like something from like the Tombstone, Arizona, era to me. I've got a quitclaim deed on your property.

[00:22:14] Elizabeth Blosser: And it's very hard to say as well.

[00:22:15] Bob: Yes, I want to call it, I want to call it a quick claim...

[00:22:18] Elizabeth Blosser: It, what a quick claim deed does uh, roll off the tongue a little bit easier.

[00:22:22] Bob: That's funny.

[00:22:23] Elizabeth Blosser: Quitclaim deed, yes.

[00:22:25] Bob: So can you tell me what a quitclaim deed is?

[00:22:28] Elizabeth Blosser: A quitclaim deed is a legal document that transfers one person's interest in a piece of property to another person. A quitclaim deed is not like other types of deeds in that it doesn't come with a guarantee around the validity of the title. It simply transfers one person's interest, assuming they have any interest in a property, to another person. Because of that, quitclaim deeds are not the sort of deeds that you would see used in what we think of as a typical real estate transaction when you're out working with a realtor. Instead, quitclaim deeds are generally used in very specific situations where the parties all know and trust each other. So an example might be transferring property between family members, or rather the interest in property between family members. A quitclaim deed might be used as part of a divorce settlement, things of that nature. So quitclaim deeds, although they vary from other types of deeds, are not inherently bad, but they are really used in a very limited way for specific low risk transactions.

[00:23:39] Bob: Why would someone use one of those as opposed to a more elaborate process?

[00:23:44] Elizabeth Blosser: Someone might use a quitclaim deed in a situation where they know and trust all the parties in the transaction. So, for example, to transfer an interest in property between family members or as part of a divorce separation, things of that nature.

[00:24:00] Bob: So because these are quick to implement, it does strike me that they have created some risks, and the criminals are using them. Can you describe for me how a criminal might use a quitclaim deed in order to essentially steal someone's home?

[00:24:13] Elizabeth Blosser: So criminals can exploit a quitclaim deed in order to transfer ownership illegally, without the legitimate property owner's knowledge or consent. And really this could be done with any type of deed. It doesn't have to be a quitclaim deed. But what criminals are going to do is file a deed in the land records and they're going to try and make it look legitimate. So they're going to use forged signatures. They might use faked or stolen identities again to get that document filed and make it look like a legitimate document in the land records. Once that deed has been filed in the land records, they are going to try and get cash out of that property. And ways they're going to do that is they're going to turn around and try and sell the property, they're going to look to take a mortgage out on the property, they might look to collect rents related to the property, anything that helps them extract cash out of that property. And all of this is really what I consider deed fraud. Deed fraud is a pretty broad term, but it includes things like quitclaim deed fraud, seller impersonation fraud. It's really when a perpetrator is seeking financial gain through crimes related to real estate and generally that's going to include filing faked or forged documents in the land records. It is important that I point out, a forged deed does not convey title. And what that means is basically if a grantor has no actual legal interest in a piece of property, the deed essentially transfers nothing. But it can still cause uh, serious financial harm for property owners, or especially due to legal costs that are associated with getting everything cleared up.

[00:26:06] Bob: Um, are vacant properties or second properties at a special risk for this kind of fraud?

[00:26:11] Elizabeth Blosser: Non-owner occupied properties are definitely at an increased risk for fraud. It's just easier for their criminals to be able to, to carry out these activities without raising any suspicion or red flags. So we of--, most often see deed fraud associated with vacant properties, second homes, rental properties, any sort of real estate where the, the owner is not occupying the property and isn't there with regularity.

[00:26:43] Bob: Seller impersonation fraud, that's the generic term for all this, essentially someone pretends to have the right to sell a property, and then uses the ownership transfer to steal money in one of a variety of ways. You might recall a story we did last year about a man who had his vacant lot sold in Connecticut by a seller impersonator. And the builder who bought it started construction on a house before it was all figured out.

[00:27:09] Elizabeth Blosser: Yeah, and that is a, an example of, of seller impersonation fraud and it does go back to the earlier point of discussion that homes that are non-owner occupied are definitely at increased risk for seller impersonation fraud, defraud of any nature.

[00:27:27] Bob: Yea, I'm glad you're using the phrase seller impersonation fraud too. I feel like that's very precise and describes exactly what's happening. Are there other flavors of seller impersonation fraud that I need you to describe as long as I have you on the horn here?

[00:27:39] Elizabeth Blosser: I think it's similar to what I said previously. It falls under the category of deed fraud which is a pretty broad term, but it's anytime you have a perpetrator who's seeking financial gain through various crimes that involve real estate and really that all hinges, generally speaking, on their ability to file fake or fraudulent documents in the land records and makes them look at legitimate as possible.

[00:28:05] Bob: It sounds like you're saying that the use of a quitclaim in the story that I'm talking about isn't special. It doesn't, quitclaim doesn't play an important role here, it could be other, other kinds of deeds, it's not necessarily that criminals are specifically targeting quitclaims for this kind of crime. Is that right?

[00:28:20] Elizabeth Blosser: That's correct. A criminal can use any sort of deed when they're filing a fraudulent document in land records. It could be a quitclaim deed, but it could also be a different type of deed. The big thing is they're going to want to be able to record it in the land records and make it look as legitimate as possible so that again, they're able to turn around and commit additional crimes involved with trying to get financial benefit out of that property, whether it's selling the property, mortgaging the property, or collecting rents on the property.

[00:28:51] Bob: A really important part of the Bilby story is that they registered to get alerts if there were any paperwork changes to their home's title. And in this case, the system worked. In fact, the Hillsborough County Clerk told local reporters that it was the first kind of success story they've had with their new alert system. A few states have implemented this kind of system statewide. The Bilbys wish more states did so, and so does Elizabeth.

[00:29:21] Bob: They were in Florida, and part of the reason they found out about this is because of a new Florida law that allows people to sign up for alerts to any changes in their property records. Are you familiar with that? And is that, is that a good idea?

[00:29:33] Elizabeth Blosser: Well protecting your home definitely starts with being vigilant and to help with that, the American Land Title Association has been advocating for states to pass laws that make property alert notifications available to everybody in the entire state for free. And states like Arizona and Florida have already passed those laws which we applaud and appreciate. If you don't live in one of those states, however, it's important to know that many counties across the country offer these services for free. You simply reach out to your county recorder, your county clerk's office, uh you can call them or check their website and see if you can sign up for one of these systems and that's basically going to alert you and let you know if any documents related to your name or your property get recorded in the land records. And so it becomes an early warning system. And that's incredibly important. When it comes to quitclaim deed fraud or other types of deed fraud, time is of the essence. The more time that goes by that you don't know about uh the fraud, the worse the problem is going to get as we discussed, a mortgage might be taken out, uh rents might be collected, other things of that nature. So it is incredibly important to be able to know that, you know, this potential crime has taken place and being able to take quick action.

[00:31:02] Bob: That sounds like that's something everybody should do as soon as they stop listening to this podcast, they should call their county clerk and see what they can sign up for, right?

[00:31:09] Elizabeth Blosser: Yeah, I would encourage everybody to reach out to their county clerk, county recorder, whoever handles land records in your jurisdiction, and ask about signing up. Many, many, many counties have this service available for free, but if your county doesn't, it is an opportunity for you to, to request that they, they offer that and more and more counties are seeing the need to offer these sorts of, of services and are rising to the occasion. So we're happy to see that.

[00:31:39] Bob: When most people buy a home, they buy title insurance to make sure there aren't any hiccups in the property transfer process. Elizabeth says standard title insurance does not protect owners from this kind of fraud we're talking about here, but insurers are starting to make that coverage available.

[00:31:56] Elizabeth Blosser: There's generally a lot of legal fees that are associated with cleaning up instances of deed fraud. And this is one reason we do encourage people as well to make sure that they are talking to a real estate attorney or a licensed regulated title professional about their options when it comes to title insurance policy coverage. You can get the homeowners uh policy of title insurance, which actually covers forgery that happens after you buy the home, and that includes associated legal costs. So that can be a great tool for people. Who pays for the policy really depends on the state that you're in. But there, there are different types of policies, and the homeowner's policy of title insurance was released about 15 years ago and is available in most parts of the country. It's an enhanced policy that covers additional things, and one of the really nice benefits is that it does cover forgery that happens in the future and that does include coverage for incurred legal costs.

[00:33:03] Bob: So a buyer might do this when they acquire a property add, add to their title insurance or protection for this, yeah.

[00:33:09] Elizabeth Blosser: Exactly.

[00:33:10] Bob: Is, is it expensive?

[00:33:11] Elizabeth Blosser: It depends on what part of the country you're in, but you know, generally several hundred dollars more expensive than a regular policy. So as you talk to your professional title agent, you can figure out if that makes sense for you.

[00:33:27] Bob: Of course, those alerts can protect you too, and they're free, and that's a good thing because seller impersonation fraud is a growing problem.

[00:33:36] Elizabeth Blosser: Obviously, fraud is on the rise across the board, and real estate is no exception to that. In fact, as it relates specifically to the title insurance industry, we have seen claims related to fraud and forgery more than double in just the last two years. And unfortunately, real estate represents a high value target for criminals. An example of that is, you know, just a single forgery title claim is going to represent about $143,000 in losses. So people do need to be working to protect their property. As we look at this data, we see that need. The FBI, for example, in 2024, received over 9000 complaints related specifically to real estate that represented over $173 million in losses.

[00:34:30] Bob: Wow.

[00:34:30] Elizabeth Blosser: The problem is real. We see that in industry data as well. Over the course of just the last two years, over 28% of title companies say they have encountered at least one case seller impersonation fraud in their business.

[00:34:46] Bob: Consumers who want to learn more can visit ALTA's website at alta.org, and look under seller impersonation fraud. There are tip sheets and public policy documents there.

[00:34:59] Elizabeth Blosser: I think the big thing is really making sure that you act quickly if you suspect or you think that you might be a victim of deed fraud. Go, the more time that goes by, the worse the problem is going to get. So first step is always, of course, to report the crime. We encourage people to report to the FBI using IC3.gov. That's the letter I, the letter C, the number 3.gov. These crimes should also immediately be reported to local law enforcement along with your state attorney general's office. And the next thing you should do is reach out to your local licensed and regulated title insurance professional. You may have a policy in place that can help you. And additionally, that title professional is going to know what steps you need to take to reverse any fraudulent filing and protect your property rights. So make sure you act fast and you bring in the professionals.

[00:35:58] Bob: Act fast when you suspect fraud. that's always good advice, and if you own property, take a moment to visit your county clerk's website and see about signing up for those fraud alerts. Remember, it's free. For The Perfect Scam, I'm Bob Sullivan.

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[00:36:24] Bob: If you have been targeted by a scam or fraud, you are not alone. Call the AARP Fraud Watch Network Helpline at 877-908-3360. Their trained fraud specialists can provide you with free support and guidance on what to do next. Our email address at The Perfect Scam is: theperfectscampodcast@aarp.org, and we want to hear from you. If you've been the victim of a scam or you know someone who has, and you'd like us to tell their story, write to us. That address again is: theperfectscampodcast@aarp.org. Thank you to our team of scambusters; Associate Producer, Annalea Embree; Researcher, Becky Dodson; Executive Producer, Julie Getz; and our Audio Engineer and Sound Designer, Julio Gonzalez. Be sure to find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts. For AARP's The Perfect Scam, I'm Bob Sullivan.

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