Influencer Couple Caught Running Home Construction Scam

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[00:00:02] Bob: This week on The Perfect Scam.

[00:00:05] Chelle Bish: I thought they were a fun couple, and I thought they had a lot of energy. They said that they wanted to be like Chip and Joanna Gaines, next generation. Mike said, "This guy does not know what he's doing." And I said, "What do you mean?" And he said, "This wall is crooked. It, it bows right there."

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[00:00:29] Bob: Welcome back to The Perfect Scam. I'm your host, Bob Sullivan.

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[00:00:34] Bob: It's always exciting to imagine a big home improvement project, putting in a brand-new bathroom or finally getting that dream kitchen, or even putting on a big addition so that there's more room for the family. Now the dream part is easy, but the reality is anything but. Home construction projects are notoriously stressful under even the best of circumstances. But if they take a wrong turn, as so many do, and there are delays, well that can be maddening. Remodeled projects are often laden with promises, not quite capped. But when do broken promises rise to the level of a crime? Let's find out.

[00:01:16] Kristin Newman: My name's Kristin Newman, and I am in Fort Worth, Texas. I'm an attorney.

[00:01:21] Bob: What kind of law do you practice?

[00:01:23] Kristin Newman: I do mostly aviation litigation, but I do kind of dabble in other kinds of civil litigation.

[00:01:30] Bob: And how long have you been a lawyer?

[00:01:32] Kristin Newman: Ten years.

[00:01:32] Bob: Ten years, and somewhere in those 10 years you decided that it would be a fun project to build your own house from scratch.

[00:01:39] Kristin Newman: That’s it, yeah.

[00:01:41] Bob: That, that sounds, the only thing I can think of that's harder than getting a law degree is building a house from scratch.

[00:01:42] Kristin Newman: That is not a lie. You are not joking.

[00:01:49] Bob: So how, tell me how you arrived at that choice?

[00:01:52] Kristin Newman: Well my parents, they built a custom home back in the early 2000s, and when I finally had gotten to a point in my career where I had paid off all of my student loans and I'd gotten to a point where I'd, I had had an opportunity to save enough for looking for a home; when I was looking for a home, I just didn't, I wasn't finding what I wanted, and so I thought, well, why don't I just build it, which is just the most naive thing I could have ever thought ever.

[00:02:24] Bob: Naive maybe, but also really excited.

[00:02:30] Kristin Newman: I thought I was going to learn some things. I knew I didn't know a whole lot about the whole process, but I was excited to learn, learn about it.

[00:02:38] Bob: Plus my experience with young attorneys is they have lots of free time.

[00:02:42] Kristin Newman: Oh yeah, lots of it, tons of it. No, not at all. This was definitely going to be a labor of love in the wee hours of the morning.

[00:02:50] Bob: So Kristin finds a plot of land, a large plot outside of town, one big enough to accommodate her dream home and maybe some other dreams.

[00:03:00] Kristin Newman: Rescue dogs are a really something that I hold dear to my heart, and one of the things I wanted to do at this house was foster and rescue dogs, and that's why I wanted some land was to be able to kind of have this opportunity. There this land down in Costa Rica that, it's like 100 acres, and they foster all of these dogs until they're able to be adopted, and I knew I couldn't do that quite yet, but I thought it would be amazing if I could do something like that here.

[00:03:30] Bob: Soon after securing the lot, she starts doing research on builders, and in truth, she's not thrilled with her options.

[00:03:39] Kristin Newman: They just, they weren't what I was looking for, right? They were either really stuck in the design that they had been building for years, which just wasn't what I wanted, or they were not flexible as far as what kind of design they wanted to build. A lot of them in this area want to build the farm home-looking house, right. And I was looking for something a little bit more, I guess, craftsman style is what I was really trying to go for.

[00:04:12] Bob: But then she hears about a new company recently founded by a young couple, Chris and Raquelle Judge. The company is called Judge DFW LLC. One of Kristin's friends says she'd gone to high school with Raquelle, vouches for her, so Kristin sets up a meeting.

[00:04:28] (clip) Hey guys, I'm Chris. And I'm Raquelle. We're with the Judge DWF Real Estate Group. And today we're at the Conn Square in Northlake, and we're going to walk through some of the benefits of buying new construction.

[00:04:37] Kristin Newman: I felt like they were kind of a breath of fresh air because all of the other builders that I've met with were, excuse the phrase, but a little bit fuddy duddy. They were my parents' age, and they all came in with this just almost a frown on their face, and they all were just, it felt like I was taking up their time.

[00:04:57] Bob: Oh God, another house I have to build.

[00:04:58] Kristin Newman: Right, exactly. Whereas when Chris and Raquelle came in the room, they were all smiles, they were all energy.

[00:05:06] Bob: Chris and Raquelle are a breath of fresh air, all high energy. That's how Chelle Bish feels about them too. Chelle and her husband Mike have been in their home since 1992 raising their family, and now it's time for a major renovation because they have a growing family in the house again.

[00:05:23] Chelle Bish: It's a big house; too much for my husband and I as empty nesters, and it's right in the heart of Dallas/Fort Worth, and it's on two acres, and it's very unusual to have this much land right in the middle of everything, so it's actually country living. And so it's a piece of property that you just don't want to let go.

[00:05:43] Bob: Let go of, sure, yeah.

[00:05:44] Chelle Bish: Yeah, so it made sense. My daughter and her husband had sold their home, and they were looking for another home, and that's when COVID hit. And so we suggested to them, not knowing what the market would do and what would happen if they were to just move in with us and let the market settle, see what impact COVID had, and then during that period of time we started talking about why not, maybe it would make sense for you guys just to live here and, and we felt it was important to go ahead and sell it to them so that they could make this home their home and my son-in-law didn't feel like he was living with his in-laws. My son-in-law travels a lot, and we help with the kids, and my daughter works a pretty demanding job, so it really, I think, has worked out well.

[00:06:34] Bob: So you live with the grandchildren.

[00:06:35] Chelle Bish: Yes. Three of them.

[00:06:38] Bob: Wow. Okay, that's very fun. But in order to accomplish all this, it sounds to me like you needed to make some alterations to the house, right?

[00:06:46] Chelle Bish: We did.

[00:06:47] Bob: So they start looking for contractors to take on the job.

[00:06:51] Chelle Bish: My daughter and her husband watching, she's in a lot of moms' groups, and so she had and so she had been putting feelers out; does anybody know a good builder where we could get some estimates. We want to do a major remodel. And it was through her moms' group that we got Chris' and Raquelle's name, and Kaylee had started following Raquelle on social media. Kaylee was following the progress of what they were doing in this, in the other homes.

[00:07:25] Bob: And Kaylee, their daughter, loves the work she sees. So Chelle agrees to meet with Judge DFW.

[00:07:34] Chelle Bish: Well, you know what, I thought they were a fun couple, and I thought they had a lot of energy, and I thought that they really were wanting to do business right, because they said that they wanted to be like Chip and Joanna Gaines, and like next generation, I guess. They were just a sweet couple.

[00:07:57] Bob: And they almost look the part, right? They almost look like they belonged on television, right?

[00:08:01] Chelle Bish: Oh yeah, and Raquelle knew social media. She was very good at that.

[00:08:08] Bob: Chelle sees a bit of herself in the young, ambitious couple.

[00:08:13] Chelle Bish: And years ago, my husband and I were young, and there were people who supported us in becoming Subway franchisees, okay, and they, it's trying to, maybe the way to look at it is to give back. People believed in us when we were young, and if they hadn't, we would not have had the opportunity to do what we did and we were, we ran our franchise for 35 years. And so we just kind of wanted to give back and we thought if we can help these young people get a good start, and we can help them by adding to their portfolio and so forth, that that would be a good thing.

[00:08:52] Bob: And they are ready to get started right away.

[00:08:55] Chelle Bish: And, and the other thing that was impressive initially was when they came out to the house, we had all the drawings from the first builder that came out. And we had actually talked to two or three prior to that. And they all took a long time. That they came out on Sunday and they walked around. He, Chris looked at my plan, or the plans that we had, and he had said oh, yeah, I can do this. I'm, we really thought, 'cause I think on his Facebook thing that Kaylee had seen that he was an architect. So he said I can make the adjustments on the plans and we don't have to, 'cause we already paid, I think, $10,000 for those plans that we had.

[00:09:38] Bob: Sure, right.

[00:09:39] Chelle Bish: And he said I can use these plans, and I can make changes and I think it was by Tuesday he was back with us with where he had made the changes that we had talked about.

[00:09:49] Bob: So Chelle and her husband move into a camper on the property and work begins almost immediately.

[00:09:56] Chelle Bish: I'm, I think it was sunny, and Chris and Raquelle did a video in the front yard, and they said, "It's a demo day in Euless," and I mean they came in with a big crew. And they tore out the kitchen, they, the middle floor they had it down to the studs, I think it probably took them two days. And they hauled off; I think it was like six dumpsters of debris.

[00:10:24] Bob: Wow.

[00:10:25] Chelle Bish: It was impressive. It was like, I'm so excited that we are helping this couple get their business started.

[00:10:34] Bob: Kristin is also quick to hire the Judge couple. As a lawyer, she makes sure all the paperwork is in order, and she has help.

[00:10:42] Kristin Newman: During this whole process, my dad, who again, built his own, helped design and build their own custom home, kind of walked me through, you're going to have to be cognizant of this wiring, and make sure that you are having this kind of plumbing and whatnot. So he was gearing me up for what was supposed to come, and all of the decisions I was about to have to make, but I signed the contract with Chris and Raquelle. About a month later, I get some rough plans for the layout of the house based on what we had discussed in the initial meeting. And we kind of go back and forth for a of couple weeks on tweaking those plans as far as the electric plans and oh, I want the garage a little bit bigger, or I want the bedrooms a little bit bigger than your typical guest bedrooms. So we do that for a couple of weeks, and we finally get some rough plans.

[00:11:38] Bob: And with that, she starts paying for the project.

[00:11:42] Kristin Newman: I put down the down payment which was supposed to go getting permits and getting those plans, and then I gave them the first draw which was for doors and windows.

[00:11:56] Bob: And roughly, how much was that?

[00:11:57] Kristin Newman: So the deposit was 10,000, and then doors and windows were 17,000, a little over 17,000. I get a, a text message from Raquelle saying, "Hey, doors and windows have been ordered." And I'm, at that time I'm thinking, that's a little weird, we don't even have a slab. But again, I just thought, well, maybe they're, they have to preorder it because of the manufacturing timeframes or because COVID, you know, had such impacts on the construction industry. Maybe they had to order it early. So and then we start picking out like lighting and doorknobs and things like that.

[00:12:35] Bob: About that foundation, well months go by and where it once felt like the project was steaming ahead, now it seems stalled.

[00:12:46] Kristin Newman: They told me that the slab was going to get poured in December. Well it didn't. And then it didn't in January. And it finally got poured, I think, in February. And that was the start of where things started to irritate me was just because I wasn't getting a lot of communication from Chris about why there was delays and things. But I also knew that it was kind of the tail end of COVID and construction was really impacted by that, and so I thought, well I need to give this grace.

[00:13:20] Bob: And then, there's a big surprise.

[00:13:24] Kristin Newman: We get to a point where finally framing is put up, and I've got framing, and then all or the sudden one day I come and there's a roof on the house, and I thought, why is there a roof on the house right now? Because particularly I haven't picked out shingles or the color of shingles, and I remember this distinctly walking up to Chris and saying, "Why is there a roof on the house? We haven't even picked this out." And he said, "Well, I just went off of the, the plans that we have." And I said, "The plans are black and white. Of course it's a black roof." So he was like, "Well, we can't tear it down now."

[00:14:05] Bob: Can't tear it down now. That sticks with Kristin.

[00:14:09] Kristin Newman: And so from there forward my little internal antennae was peaked, and I was like, okay, I'm, now I'm watching everything. And there were, there were times where I would come out to the house because the house is like an hour away from where I live now that it wasn't like I could get out there every single day. It was mostly like the weekends or every other weekend. And so there would be a time where I would come out there and electric would be out, would be put into the house. And there'd be these massive holes in the framing, the pieces of wood. And I'm going, that just annihilated the integrity of that piece of wood. And he was like, it's fine, we'll just put braces up.

[00:14:57] Bob: Oh boy.

[00:14:58] Bob: From there, it feels like the mistakes start piling up.

[00:15:03] Kristin Newman: One of the big kickers when framing was up, I noticed that the half bath toilet plumbing was in the wall that it was supposed to be next to. So it was a good foot off of where it was actually supposed to be. And that happened two other times. There was some plumbing measurement problems that affected me having to move where it was, because one was in a window.

[00:15:37] Bob: Oh boy.

[00:15:38] Kristin Newman: I'm going, how do you not see this? It's like you didn't have a tape measure when you were putting the pex in. So if I'm going into too much detail, I apologize.

[00:15:49] Bob: Yeah, I'm sure every single one of these was like a arrow to the heart, right?

[00:15:53] Kristin Newman: Right, it really was, and...

[00:15:55] Bob: 'Cause every time you see one of these things, you, I'm sure think of what else is wrong that we've missed, right?

[00:16:01] Kristin Newman: Yes. You almost feel like something else pops up and you're going, great. What else did I miss? What else is happening?

[00:16:08] Bob: What else is happening? Chelle and her husband get a taste of that feeling, too right away, even though they're impressed by the size of the crew that arrives on day one, well something bothers Mike that day.

[00:16:21] Chelle Bish: And Mike said, "This guy does not know what he's doing." And I said, "What do you mean?" And he said, "He didn't cover up the air conditioning vents." So we have floor vents. So all of the floor vents that were removed, but all the debris had gone down into the ductwork.

[00:16:36] Bob: Ooh.

[00:16:37] Chelle Bish: And Mike said, "A builder or whatever that knows what he's doing knows that you cover the vent to protect the integrity of your HVAC."

[00:16:47] Bob: Sure.

[00:16:48] Chelle Bish: And I was like, "Oh, I didn't notice that." But he did. And that was on day one.

[00:16:54] Bob: So you raise that concern, and Chris said, oh, we'll fix it, but what happened there?

[00:16:59] Chelle Bish: Yeah, he said, "We'll get the ducts cleaned out at the end."

[00:17:02] Bob: We'll fix it at the end, he says. That quickly becomes a trend.

[00:17:08] Chelle Bish: And they started to put up the new trim work outside. The trim work was awful. And Mike would tell Chris, he goes, "This is not even right." And Chris said, "Well, we'll come back and we'll fix that at the end." And Mike said, "That doesn't make sense because you're getting ready to caulk this, you're getting ready to paint this, and it's going to have to be torn out and redone for it to be done right." And it was things like that that it was the quality of the workmanship and that when they were putting in some of the flooring, Mike said, "This wall is crooked. It, it bows right there." And he would take Chris and show him. And he said, "You need to cut that sheetrock out and you need to make that wall straight. It's not straight." And then Chris would say, "Well, we'll do a punch out at the end, and then we'll get all that fixed." And Mike would say, "It doesn't make sense for you to do that, Chris." He said, "You need to do it now. You need to do all these things as you go."

[00:18:14] Bob: It sounds like he said a, a lot of times, we'll fix that at the end.

[00:18:17] Kristin Newman: Yes. And that was his MO. It's fine, we'll fix it later. I can't tell you how many times I heard that.

[00:18:26] Bob: Well Kristin decides she isn't going to sit around and wait for the end. She wants a second opinion. The Judges aren't thrilled with that.

[00:18:36] Kristin Newman: Yeah, I said, "Hey, we need to get electrical, we need to get the roof inspected, make sure everything's good." Because I kept asking, hey did you get an engineer to look at, I think it's an engineer, to look at the roof and make sure the roof, the slopes were right and whatnot. And it turns out no. He didn't. And so I wanted to make sure at least the electrical was correct before we put up drywall. 'Cause like I said, I didn't want something to happen and us turn on a switch, and it start a fire inside the wall.

[00:19:09] Bob: Yeah, sure.

[00:19:09] Kristin Newman: Or I wanted to make sure that the plumbing was correct so that we're not having drips inside drywall, and we're having to rip out drywall later. I, he got very, very offended when I said I wanted to get an inspector out there before the drywall went up. And I was perplexed by that, because I felt well if there's nothing, if everything's good then we should be fine and it's just money out of my pocket to, to get this inspector out there. It's not like it's going to take much time out of his schedule. So it shouldn't have affected him as much, but he was very offended.

[00:19:49] Bob: Very, very offended. Some people just don't like having their work questioned, and that's a bad sign.

[00:19:58] Kristin Newman: My inspector came back with a 100-page report saying all of this had to be fixed or your house is essentially going to catch on fire as far as the electrical and the plumbing would have been, would have been flooded and all that jazz. And this guy he got on the roof, he got in the rafters and checked all the electrical and the plumbing that was there at the time. And I mean he found that there were valleys in my roof that were, would hold water. Uh, he found...

[00:20:28] Bob: Valleys in your roof, that sounds like a very dangerous expression.

[00:20:32] Kristin Newman: Oh yeah, like it's something you never want to hear.

[00:20:35] Bob: No, valleys in the roof.

[00:20:36] Kristin Newman: When he, when he told me that I was going, "So I need a whole new roof?" And he said, "Yeah, you, this is not something you could just like patch or fix, you have to redo the whole roof." And he said, "Oh by the way, you're going to have to redo the rafters as well..."

[00:20:50] Bob: Okay, so I'm guessing you showed that report to him, right, and what did he say?

[00:20:54] Kristin Newman: I did. And Chris said, "All this is stuff we can fix towards the end."

[00:20:59] Bob: Yeah, toward the end. Yeah.

[00:21:00] Kristin Newman: I said, "You're not putting sheetrock up until all of this is fixed."

[00:21:06] Bob: And that demand leads to Chris asking for more money.

[00:21:11] Kristin Newman: So I said, okay, well I'm going to give you this draw, but I need to see significant work in the next week or so. So I give him the draw and then immediately realize...

[00:21:21] Bob: How much was that for, do you know?

[00:21:23] Kristin Newman: That was for 20,000.

[00:21:26] Bob: But the $20,000 doesn't light a fire under the judges. And now it's spring and there are more complications with having a half-built house.

[00:21:35] Kristin Newman: And I said, "Hey, you guys haven't been out here. We're just sitting out here with framing. And it's, we're getting into thunderstorm season of Texas. You need to at least watertight the house." And he said, "Yeah, we're going to come out there and put, we're going to put sheetrock in the house." And I said, "Has there been an inspection?" And he said, "No, we'll get the inspection at the very end." And I said, "No, you're not putting sheetrock up without an inspection on the plumbing and the electrical, because we're not going to get the house all tied up together and then come to find out that the electrical has died, and we're going to have to rip out, we're going to have to rip out walls."

[00:22:18] Bob: And that confrontation, well it's the last one she'll have with the Judges.

[00:22:24] Kristin Newman: So as soon as I pushed back on that, he stopped communicating pretty much altogether.

[00:22:35] Bob: Silence. Kristin has a half-built home with a laundry list of problems, and Judge DFW has about $200,000 of her money. Eventually it's clear, Judge DFW has walked on the job. Meanwhile, the mistakes keep piling up at Chelle's home, and the whole family is concerned, especially Lane, he son-in-law.

[00:22:57] Chelle Bish: Lane was a woodworker. So he used to do it as a hobby, but then he did it as a business. And, and he's very meticulous about what he does, so when the kitchen cabinets came in, Lane was like, these, these cabinets, he told Chris, he said, "This is, these cabinets are nothing but junk." Those shelves that pull out, they're probably 8 or 9 inches shorter than the depth of the cabinet. And the cabinets, you opened up one cabinet, and the side panels all you saw were screws sticking out, the pointed parts of the screws all sticking out. It was just terrible, and the other thing I noticed is that probably around mid-June, I noticed that the workers weren't coming. It was just Billy and Ryan, which were family members of Chris's. And they would be the only two that would work.

[00:23:58] Bob: So you went from having a team of what, 10 people, 20?

[00:24:02] Chelle Bish: Oh yeah, initially, yeah.

[00:24:03] Bob: To, to just, to just immediately family.

[00:24:06] Chelle Bish: Yeah.

[00:24:08] Bob: At this point, Chelle has given the Judge's about $275,000, and well it seems like nothing has been done right.

[00:24:17] Chelle Bish: We had almost paid him the full amount of the job, and we took issues with the front stairs because they had no safety railings on there. And they, it was just, so much that was wrong, and I said, "All that stuff has got to be fixed." And he came and he said, "Well, I need $10,000." And I told him, I said, "I'm done writing you checks." And I remember, we had this meeting in the camper. And he goes, "Well," and this is, and then Mike, and after this meeting Mike says, "We're in trouble." He says, "This isn't going good. This is not going to end well I don't think."

[00:24:55] Bob: This is not going to end well. So eventually they decide it's time to break up with the Judges. They meet with a lawyer and discover they're not alone.

[00:25:06] Chelle Bish: Mike and I and Kaylee and Lane went and talk to him, and he said, "Wait a minute." He said, "I've got another client with this same company."

[00:25:14] Bob: Ah.

[00:25:15] Chelle Bish: And we were like, what? And that's where when we met with him, he said that in his research that Chris had already had another judgment, and he had not paid. And he said, the attorney said, "I don't feel that it is right for me to take your money when I know we can file this suit and you're not going to get anything. So you're going to be paying me to get you a judgment, and you're not going to get any money from that judgment." He said, "My recommendation is for you to go home, call your local police department, and file a report."

[00:25:55] Bob: Call your local police department. Chris and Raquelle aren't just screw ups, perhaps they are criminals. And there's something else.

[00:26:05] Kristin Newman: And I just happened to get a Facebook message from one of the victims that said, "Hey, I think you're the other house down here in Jonathan County that's being built by Judge DFW." And I said, "Yes, who is this?" And they told me, and they said, "Well I'm going to add you to this group, because there's a whole victim group." And I thought, what? Just my heart dropped immediately thinking this happened to other people? And then I realized how many other people it happened to, and it just, there was a flurry of emotions from that.

[00:26:44] Bob: So Chelle and Mike decide to go to the police. Initially, they are met with skepticism. Isn't this just a civil dispute? But eventually their report gets to Detective Brian Brennan.

[00:26:57] Bob: Okay, so they come to you with this complaint; we have a builder and the builder didn't do what he said. Doesn't that sound like a lot of complaints you hear?

[00:27:04] Det. Brennan: It does. Typically with a one-person situation, this would fall under what we call a civil situation where we're not crossing the lines of the law criminally, but it's going to be a, a civil problem which they'd have to solve in civil court.

[00:27:23] Bob: And they just sue each other, leave you out of it, right?

[00:27:25] Det. Brian Brennan: Exactly.

[00:27:27] Bob: Well what made this case seem different to you?

[00:27:30] Det. Brian Brennan: As I dove into the case, I found out that there was a lot more victims involved. They had created a Facebook page, and on that Facebook page numerous people found them through Raquelle and Chris Judge's names, and once I found out that wow, okay, we've got more than one family, we're starting to get up to 15, then 20, then 25. And it just, it went up from there. And once I determined I had I think 28 projects across 7 counties with over 40 victims, that passes the threshold of civil liability and goes into criminal based on you're showing an intent.

[00:28:15] Bob: So Detective Brennan starts contacting all those victims, sets up a meeting with them.

[00:28:20] Bob: So I just can't imagine the tension in the air at a meeting like this. What was it like?

[00:28:26] Det. Brian Brennan: It was really hard, because these people, this was their dream, right? Some of them were building their dream homes. Some of them were building their retirement homes. Some of them were remodeling their homes to have their parents come live with them. And these people invested hundreds of thousands of dollars. Overall combined it was over $4 million and essentially were left with some were just basically framing in the air with a roof, some were just the foundations, some didn't even have a foundation. So I kind of put a little onus on each couple or person and said, these are, I want to hear from everybody. And I will call you individually, but what I need to do is I kind of gave them a homework list so to speak of things that I needed so I could prosecute this case properly and neatly. And that was telling them, hey, I need emails, I need text messages, copies of checks, any type of photos, anything that you have. Do you have any engineering reports, anything.

[00:29:32] Bob: In part because Detective Brennan was working on a task force at the time, he brings the case to the US attorney who agrees to send a target letter to the Judges telling them they're being investigated by federal agents for a conspiracy to commit wire fraud.

[00:29:47] Det. Brennan: And then one at a time, we'd bring them in a meeting with the US Attorney at the US Attorney's Office. We do a PowerPoint which is a brief overview of the case, and a synopsis to let the defense know that hey, this is an opportunity for you to advise your client to look at maybe a plea deal, to get downward departure points and punishment, or no, we're not, we're going to take it to trial. In their case, they did not want to take a plea deal.

[00:30:17] Bob: Ah, that sounds like you were surprised by that.

[00:30:19] Det. Brennan: I was 'cause we had a lot of evidence. But I think in their mind, I think they really hung onto the concept that, hey, this is a civil situation, not a criminal. And us filing bankruptcy absolved us of any criminal liability, and that's not the case.

[00:30:39] Bob: But Detective Brennan is sure this is no simple disagreement between builder and homeowner.

[00:30:46] Bob: What made this case different do you think?

[00:30:49] Det. Brennan: On this case, 'cause we clearly had criminal elements of an offense. We clearly had the wire fraud elements of the offense. We had the conspiracy to commit wire fraud. We clearly had emails, text messages. We know that there was, we tracked all the wire transfers from banking institutions and personal accounts that were going to their accounts. They spent a lot of money on personal expenses and living expenses, and most importantly, the text messages, when you're putting out on, on social media too on their posts that he's an architect and they're a one-stop shop and he's not an architect, and then text messages are coming back like hey, we purchased your windows. We need to collect this much money from you. These are things that are clearly not true. He was not an architect. He received a letter from the Architectural Permission of Texas to cease and desist.

[00:31:39] Bob: Okay, so I mean to me it seems like pretty clear, you claim you're an architect, that's a very specific licensed profession, and you're not; that's fraud, right? That seems pretty clear. But this idea that you might show up, start a project and run out of money or something. I mean I do think that, that kind of thing happens a lot in the construction business and I, the reason I'm kind of harping on this point is a lot of people have disputes with their builders, right? And so I'm wondering what I, for somebody who's listening, how can I help them decide, well what is just the way the construction works and what is a crime?

[00:32:15] Det. Brennan: Well they have, there's, every state has its own property code. In the state of Texas, we have a property code, and then in that property code is Section 161 which specifically talks about construction projects. And a lot of, I can't speak for every state 'cause they each have their own, but a lot of states, typically when you're doing a construction, a large remodel, or a new construction home, they're supposed to have an account set up individually for that specific project. In this case, he comingled everybody's monies together so there was no way to determine whose money was what, other than when we could track them coming into the initial deposits. But if you don't, that's a clear violation there.

[00:33:03] Bob: And they used money that people had given them to buy windows or doors or pay electricians, and one of them or both of them used that for plastic surgery?

[00:33:12] Det. Brennan: There was some monies used for plastic surgery, that is correct. They came in there through people's deposits and stuff and it was utilized to pay for that amongst other things. There was some, I think a new car that was purchased. There was just a lot of different things; Amazon, credit cards being paid for, just a lot of different bills being paid, personal expenses and whatnot. Some travel. Nothing like extraordinary because they obviously did spend some money and a decent amount of money on the construction process, but it, nothing was done up to code. Nothing was done within the standards in the laws in the State of Texas. A lot of subs were not paid. It, it is just, this is not how you do the building process at all.

[00:34:03] Bob: When we talk about the size of this crime and the, the victims left behind, I mean it's even more than $5 million and the 28 or so projects, right?

[00:34:13] Det. Brennan: Oh, absolutely. I mean if you think about people's lost wages, you think about people who had to purchase RVs, they had to pay rent and rental properties. They were completely disrupted; their whole lives were turned upside down when they were thinking they were purchasing their dream, they were basically purchasing a nightmare.

[00:34:32] Bob: In the end, the Judges plead guilty in December of 2025. Chelle attends their sentencing hearing, and it just fills her with frustration.

[00:34:41] Chelle Bish: Chris had a ridiculous smirk on his face when he walked in the courthouse to be sentenced, and there was no sincerity of apology to say, you guys, I am so sorry. When I listened to the statements that they made to the judge, their impact statements, I, I just, if I was not holding a squishy ball, I don't know what I would have done, because I was just squeezing that thing, it was making me so angry because all of the things that they were saying was, I think, solely for the benefit of the judge and that's not really and truly how they felt.

[00:35:20] Bob: Ultimately, Christopher Judge is sentenced to 78 months in federal prison. Raquelle Judge is sentenced to one month. Both are ordered to pay $2.8 million in restitution. The victims are left to pick up the pieces.

[00:35:35] Bob: Okay, so that, you obviously had to hire someone else to clean up after this mess, right? How much did you have to pay?

[00:35:42] Kristin Newman: Total, we had to pay $300,000 to fix what he did and then get it to finished.

[00:35:53] Bob: Wow. How much did you give him total?

[00:35:56] Kristin Newman: So we gave him, or I gave him, 200,000.

[00:36:00] Bob: So you spent a half a million dollars on this project.

[00:36:03] Kristin Newman: Yes.

[00:36:03] Bob: Wow. And, and what, at the outset, what was it supposed to cost?

[00:36:07] Kristin Newman: So he quoted us, or the estimate all was 350.

[00:36:13] Bob: So that's $150,000 you didn't expect to spend.

[00:36:16] Kristin Newman: Yes.

[00:36:17] Bob: And what did that do to you?

[00:36:19] Kristin Newman: I drained my savings. I have; I can't put anything in savings. I had to borrow from my parents. I had to move back in with my parents because I can't, I'm paying on my loan which is essentially a double a of mortgage payment, and I mean I'm completely depleted as far as financial savings.

[00:36:43] Bob: Ugh, and you're paying for a loan for a house you don't even have, right?

[00:36:47] Kristin Newman: Exactly. And I, I'm, it's not like I can stay in it, because I'm, I have to sell it to pay back my loan to just get back to the start, to where I was five years ago.

[00:37:01] Bob: Things are equally complicated for Chelle and Mike.

[00:37:05] Chelle Bish: So we had to rip out the wall in the bathroom. We have to replace all of our floors. And we've got to do that, and we have to replace the kitchen cabinets. They're not, they're not holding up at all.

[00:37:17] Bob: But were you able to move back in?

[00:37:19] Chelle Bish: Yeah, we did, we moved back in just the way we, I said let's just make it livable and get in there. And we'll just live with it for as long as we can live with it and we'll...

[00:37:27] Bob: You had to pay some other contractor to make it livable, is that what happened?

[00:37:30] Chelle Bish: Yes. Well we had to, for us to be able to move in, we had to rip out the staircase and rebuild that. We had to rip off the front porch and rebuild that. We had to redo the back patio, so we had to make all of those things safe before we could get the CO to move in.

[00:37:47] Bob: Oh my God. We're getting up close to half a million dollars here by the time this is all done.

[00:37:51] Chelle Bish: Yeah.

[00:37:53] Bob: Wow.

[00:37:54] Bob: Kristin is slowly working to start over. As she mentioned, she's living at home again, and as she reflects on everything, could she have done anything different? Well remember, she's a lawyer, her dad's a lawyer, and her parents had built a home from scratch. She's uniquely prepared for this kind of transaction, and yet...

[00:38:14] Kristin Newman: There's a lot of the comments on the, the media stories that have come out that people are saying, these people didn't do their homework, and you've got to interview so many people. And the thing is that I did. I did interview people, and I just don't think that you can see a scammer coming all the time. And I think that's an unfortunate and hard lesson to learn is that you can build up your knowledge base and you can be as vigilant as possible, but at the end of the day sometimes those, those scammers are just going to scam. I feel like I should have seen it coming, and, and I just didn't. And I didn't until things became incredibly obvious. And it's the little bitty red flags, not the huge ones that really were what got me, I think, is that like once the, the big red flags were out there, I was, I was on top of it, but it's the little bitty ones that I just of let go or would say, I would justify it in some, some form or fashion. You can't be your own home inspector just like you can't be your own car mechanic. Sometimes it just happens and you have to go get a second opinion.

[00:39:39] Bob: Yeah, you can't be your own dentist, right?

[00:39:41] Kristin Newman: Right, yeah.

[00:39:42] Bob: All these, we rely on people's professionalism in all sorts of walks of life.

[00:39:47] Bob: And so, Kristin wishes there were better ways to protect consumers in this situation. For starters, it's great that Detective Brennan followed up on a case, but many other victims didn't get that response when they went to police.

[00:40:00] Kristin Newman: For several people, several of the victims tried to take it to their local police departments and every single one of them said it was a civil matter. And there has to be a better way to get them involved because otherwise you're just going to keep having these kind, these general contractors scamming people. I think the more that there are prosecutions of these types of crimes, then I think you're going to have more deterrents, but it's going to take, it's going to take somebody to take on the case, and Detective Brennan, I can't thank him enough for taking on this case because it truly was five years of his life just combing through everybody's financials and all of their documentations to get to the sentencing itself. And I think that I realize these cases are a lot more work, white collar crimes aren't the sexy crimes, but I think that, I think they affect just as many people.

[00:41:01] Bob: Kristin also would like to see new regulations to protect consumers.

[00:41:06] Kristin Newman: You know I'd like to see some licensing happen for general contractors. It seems like for subcontractors, plumbing, electrical in particular, they all have to be licensed. But in Texas anyways, general contractors don't. You have to have a measuring tape and a truck, and you can just go out there and start building a house. I feel like if you're not going to do licensing for, for general contractors, then there needs to be some kind of requirement through the state, or even county by county that says permit, you have to have a building permit. You have to also have a sign-off that you file with the city that says, or the county that says, yes, this structure was signed off by an architect. This structure was signed off by a plumber. And that way, I think that at least you, it puts more red tape in the process, but I think that at least you have better homes built.

[00:42:05] Bob: Chelle still feels terrible about all that happened, especially because she was trying to help out a young couple just starting out.

[00:42:14] Chelle Bish: You know, well I think you just really, I don't know, you just have to be so cautious and even though you really like somebody, it's like the wolf in sheep's clothing. You think they're, they really have the right heart, and you want them to have the right heart, but I think once the money starts flowing in, that it's hard to keep them honest. And it just, just made me doubt my judge of character, and I feel like I've always been pretty good at that, but that certainly made me question that. So I'm way more skeptical now about doing things, having people come and do things, or even taking the car in for repair, anything like that--very skeptical. And I, I hate feeling that way.

[00:42:58] Bob: There's one other thought Chelle had which she wanted to share with people considering home improvement projects. She wishes she had a journal of progress, weekly or even daily with pictures.

[00:43:10] Chelle Bish: My sister told me I should do that, and I thought, oh, I really don't need to. Chris and Raquelle, they're the real deal. But you really need to. I definitely think journaling the activities, the comings and the goings, pictures of what was done on Monday and what was done on Friday so you can really see from room to room if progress is really being made. I wished I'd have done that, because I think I would have seen it sooner and when it's on paper, it's not easy to deny.

[00:43:47] Bob: Detective Brennan has seen his share of construction crimes, so he has a lot of thoughts about how listeners can protect themselves.

[00:43:55] Det. Brennan: I recommend people, for your listeners specifically and anybody for that matter, get three to five bids. And compare the list of materials, the timeframe, and the cost of the labor. And what I mean by that is set the contracts down, look at them. They're not all going to be the same, but they should be in the somewhat range of ballpark per square foot. 200, 250, whatever the, the amount of money is. But if one is significantly cheaper and just stands out, that, I would encourage people to be wary of that. That's probably a red flag. And, and the bids, it's important to get numerous bids so you can see what you're looking at. What's the timeframe? What's the cost? How does he go through the process? How well does he communicate? There's a lot of different variables, and then once you determine your company, the next thing I suggest before you sign, you research the company you're thinking of choosing. How long have they been in business? Has there been any complaints about, against them? Do they have any references from previous jobs? Can I speak with those references about their building experience? These are important first steps that people need to take because they're investing a lot of money in homes, hundreds of thousands of dollars, and a lot of times it's these people's nest eggs. So it is so important, you have to take an active role in that. The next thing, you sign the contract and review it carefully before you give any money. Even possibly even taking it to an attorney. It's worth it because you're investing of hundreds of thousands of dollars; you don't want to take something lightly, correct?

[00:45:38] Bob: Yeah, of course.

[00:45:39] Det. Brennan: And then I tell people as, as I said, take an active role. Walk your construction site daily whether it's new construction or remodel. Take photos and document the progress. And that way, if there's a problem, you can go back to that specific period of time in your building process, because you've had notes and you created a, a, and you documented the whole process. And above all, just if nothing's happening or it's not moving forward, stop paying money. That's the most important thing, because you're just going to throw another 20,000 on that 100,000 you mentioned earlier in the conversation, now you're out another 20,000. So...

[00:46:21] Bob: That makes, yeah, I think that's the really most important piece of advice. If something's wrong, don't write more checks.

[00:46:26] Det. Brennan: Don't write more checks. Stop and ask questions.

[00:46:29] Bob: But as you know, I'm not a fan of putting all the onus on consumers. We can't be experts in everything. Builders have a lot of power over homeowners in these situations. And there are clearly gaps in consumer protection, gaps the Judges knew how to exploit.

[00:46:45] Det. Brennan: Yes, most cities and counties have what's called a code enforcement, or code compliance. Those are the folks that unfortunately give you the tickets for the tall grass, the junk cars, the illegally parked RVs in the street. Those are the, the folks that do that. But they also do the same thing when it comes to occupancy for homes. They go in, they are walking through the build process to making sure that these projects are up to code per the State of Texas, or whichever state the construction project's in.

[00:47:19] Bob: So there's a problem in rural areas where people are less likely to, to... yeah.

[00:47:24] Det. Brennan: In rural areas, a lot of times out in the counties they don't have a code compliance, and he kind of knew that, so several of these home builds were in really rural, small towns. And knowing that there's no code compliance, he could get away with that.

[00:47:43] Bob: They thought they could get away with it because there wasn’t anyone around to enforce the law. It’s just so frustrating to I hear things like that. And it’s frustrating to hear that a police officer decides a crime isn’t prosecutable. After all, that’s a decision which should be left to a prosecutor. And in fact – many citizens don’t know this – but if you aren’t happy with the response you get from a police officer, you can reach out to the prosecutor yourself. How would you do that? Well, fortunately there’s a retired prosecutor who’s also a friend of The Perfect Scam – Paul Greenwood – and he’s here today to talk with us about just how consumers can get justice at a time like this. Paul was born in the U.K. but moved to California a long time ago and spent 25 years working in the San Diego District Attorney’s Office.

[00:48:36] Bob: The victims in this case, and I think the victims of many situations like this, the initial response they often get from a, they call a police department, they walk into the police department and that's exactly what they're told. This is, sue them, this is a civil case. That can feel like the end of the road, but is it?

[00:48:53] Paul Greenwood: Well it depends on the jurisdiction and on the, the backbone of uh, the prosecutors who uh operate in that same area because I would always encourage homeowners to also contact my office if they've got pushback from the police department. And I would also engage with, in California, our statewide agency that actually regulates contractors. Uh, and, and every state typically has a state agency that issues licenses. And within that state agency, there are investigators who will go out to the site of where the complaint is and do their own independent investigation regardless of anything that law enforcement may or may not have done. And then they will bring their reports to, to my office. And that's where I got most of my success in prosecuting contractor for was from the, the state agency.

[00:49:57] Bob: What's the name of that agency in California?

[00:49:59] Paul Greenwood: It's the Contractor State License Board, CSLB, which has a wonderful website, CSLB.ca.gov.

[00:50:08] Bob: Now it'll be different in different states, but so many states have something similar, right?

[00:50:13] Paul Greenwood: Exactly. They, they do. And some of them are housed within their state attorney general's consumer protection department, but there are other standalone state agencies. And that's all they do is issue licenses, revoke licenses, and carryout investigations for homeowners such as the ones in Texas.

[00:50:33] Bob: And one thing that I believe sometimes works, obviously not all the time, but sometimes, if you talk to your contractor and you just throw around the name of the appropriate state agency, that might actually get them to cooperate more, right?

[00:50:49] Paul Greenwood: Well that's true. And, and it's all about homeowners being informed before they embark upon a product, particularly a project that involves a great deal of investment of monies, or, or major reconstruction uh, project or, or a brand-new home. That needs a lot of homework and research before they ever commit to one particular contractor.

[00:51:16] Bob: One thing that, that you've said I, that I think will be news to most people is the idea that if you're not happy with the police officer who you talked to, you're kind of pushed aside and they say, oh, it's a civil matter, that you can actually directly reach out to a prosecutor, right?

[00:51:32] Paul Greenwood: You can, and I'm sure if any prosecutors are listening to this uh podcast, Bob, they will push back to me and say, oh come on, Greenwood, you can't do that because we're so busy in court. I'm sorry, but I am a, I was, for 25 years, a public servant within the County of San Diego, and I do believe that I am, should be available to receive calls. And, and again, it's all about time management. You take a call. You listen very carefully for 10 minutes to a homeowner's complaints, and then you know enough from asking specific questions of that homeowner whether number one, this is a righteous complaint; number two, who should be involved? And so when I would get those calls, I would either um, go back to the police department that said to them it was a civil matter, or I would direct the homeowner to file a complaint with the Contractor State License Board, and then I would myself contact that agency and say, look out for this complaint because I think it's got legs. I think you should really uh, jump on it, and then when you have, get in touch back with me.

[00:52:38] Bob: Is it worth just spending a moment um, since you've been on those 10-minute phone calls, I'm sure there are specific things you're looking for where either you say, oh, this sounds like fraud, this sounds like the contractor's lying or not delivering something they promised, or this sounds like somebody who's a little too particular. Well what, what things do you listen for to, to discover that distinction?

[00:52:59] Paul Greenwood: First of all, I want to know um, how they made contact with the contractor. Who made the first move? Did they solicit them or were they called, cold-called or did somebody come and knock on the door with an iPad and get them to sign a contract? I would then, while we're talking, look up the name of that contractor on the CSLB website to see if they are indeed licensed. I would then ask the homeowner, tell me what promises did that contractor make for you verbally before you committed to sign to your contract? And then I would ask, well have, have any of those promises been breached? In what way do you feel they've been breached? Do you have photographic evidence? Where is the contractor right now? Is he still trying to string you along? Is he still in communication with you or has he vanished? Those are the types of questions that I feel can get me to an answer within 10 minutes as to whether this is a crime worth pursuing.

[00:53:59] Bob: Okay, so a consumer's thinking about calling a prosecutor and saying, hey I, I really want someone to take a second look at this. I was rebuffed at the, at my local police department. What kind of things can someone do before they call you that will make you listen better or be more receptive to their complaints?

[00:54:16] Paul Greenwood: Hopefully, they have already documented what the complaints are, so they have photographs, visual effects to show anybody, a police officer, a prosecutor like myself, look at what they've done. I would also have the homeowner check with their city building regs department, particularly to see if a permit is required for the type of work that they contracted to do with the contractor. Has the contractor applied for a permit, and many often times the, they contractor would tell the homeowner, oh yes, it's just a delay; it takes a few weeks, only to find out that no such permit application was ever made. Those are the types of things that would immediately get my attention and focus, and allow me to spend a few min--, more minutes with that homeowner to get more information and pass it on to the police department or the licensed agency that ov--, overrules these uh contractors. Now I have to tell you though, Bob, that there are many prosecutors out there who will not share my opinion. They will say, well, there was partial performance. That at least the guy came and, and when he took the money, he came out and he did start the work. So I'm not comfortable in looking at a criminal investigation when there's been partial performance. I had never allowed partial performance to be a defense because again, within that partial performance, you can probably find lots of defects that will support your argument that this fell way below the standards that the market requires. And that it was criminal.

[00:55:58] Bob: I'm glad you actually threw that phrase out, partial performance, because that also is hanging in the back of my head. Uh, these, these bands of criminals who go through neighborhoods and say I think your roof is leaking. Let me do your, you know, a roof for you right now since we're in the neighborhood, and then they take your money and disappear. I think many folks would put them in a different category than what we're talking about here. Um, and, and but that different category doesn't mean that they're not both crimes, right?

[00:56:26] Paul Greenwood: Exactly. And so, obviously the vast majority of the defendants that I prosecuted were unlicensed or even weren't authorized to accept money over $500. But there was still licensed contractors that I prosecuted who should have known better, who knew the rules, and violated those rules. So, so just because they are licensed doesn't give them an exemption. Just because they did partial performance doesn't give them a built-in defense.

[00:56:59] Bob: You know a critical moment in this story is when Chelle goes to a lawyer and that lawyer says, I won't take your money because I already have other complaints against this contractor. And that was when, you know, the bell went off that it really was a crime. That there was, you know, more than one case of this.

[00:57:13] Paul Greenwood: Well that, and that's the point, Bob. Because, because one thing I would do if a case was brought to me, uh, of this one contractor, I would often say to myself, well this is not the first time he's done this. And I would have a law clerk go to our courthouse and look up the name of the contractor as a defendant in civil cases. And it was extraordinary how often that name would pop up as being a defendant on a homeowner plaintiff's case. The other place I always go, Bob, is the Better Business Bureau. Because over the 25 years I found this to be true; homeowners who get a, a real problem with a contractor and are being defrauded, may not go to the police because they're embarrassed, they certainly won't tell their adult children, but what they do do is they could complain to the Better Business Bureau. And so I've often called the BBB and say, hey, do you have any complaints against this guy that I've just heard about? And sure enough, there are two or three other complaints. So right there, I am building a much stronger case involving three to four victims, either through the civil court index, or through the Better Business Bureau database.

[00:58:31] Bob: Okay, so talking turkey, prosecutors will say either, you know, I'm too busy for this; I have too many cases. Or this case is squishy enough that while maybe it's a crime, it's going to be really hard to convince a judge and a jury o--, over this. How should consumers ready themselves for that frustrating news?

[00:58:54] Paul Greenwood: And that is a reality. So yes, accept the fact that a prosecutor may well do that. Now is there any way that you can change that prosecutor's mind? Possibly. And, and it comes down to personal details and the impact that this crime is having on the homeowner and their immediate family. And that's where it would affect me because of my position as head of an elder protection unit. The homeowners that were calling me were typically over the age of 65. And homeowners who go through a contractor forward situation who are say 70, 75, 80 years of age, the emotional impact, the mental health impact, and the physical health impact is absolutely uh, enormous. And so I would never discount that. And, and I would always pay attention to how it is affecting that person. I would never, ever tell a person, I'm sorry, but I'm too busy. And, and prosecutors who do that, I, I would say then you need to bring that to the attention of your county purse strings, that if you are unable to assist a victim who's going through a nightmare, that's not a, an easy, or readily available excuse to say I'm too busy. You need to try to fix that problem by getting more resources handed to your office so you can help this victim.

[01:00:41] Bob: Bob: For The Perfect Scam, I'm Bob Sullivan.

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[01:00:56] Bob: If you have been targeted by a scam or fraud, you're not alone. Call the AARP Fraud Watch Network Helpline at 877-908-3360. Their trained fraud specialists can provide you with free support and guidance on what to do next. Our email address at The Perfect Scam is: theperfectscampodcast@aarp.org, and we want to hear from you. If you've been the victim of a scam or you know someone who has, and you'd like us to tell their story, write to us. That address again is: theperfectscampodcast@aarp.org. Thank you to our team of scambusters; Associate Producer, Annalea Embree; Researcher, Becky Dodson; Executive Producer, Julie Getz; and our Audio Engineer and Sound Designer, Julio Gonzalez. Be sure to find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts. For AARP's The Perfect Scam, I'm Bob Sullivan.

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