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The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
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Government & Elections
The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
<font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif" size="1">With elections coming up, there’s no shortage of dialogue here. Whether you're a red state Republican or a blue state Democrat, everyone is welcome — just remember to be civil.</font>
I'd just like to counter a lot of the arguments raised about this pipeline. First, there are 10's of thousands of miles of oil, gas, etanol and CO2 pipelines traversing this country. Pipelines are an
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Cat:d51398b3-89f9-463d-bf1b-4b885f02c9eeForum:af978875-5bc6-4b07-a6fb-b18062132f95
Cat:d51398b3-89f9-463d-bf1b-4b885f02c9eeForum:af978875-5bc6-4b07-a6fb-b18062132f95Discussion:0a1370af-6314-463c-8816-f1980067299d
Forums » Politics & Society » Government & Elections » The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
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The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
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The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at March 30, 2012 3:20 PM EDT
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Posts: 471
First: December 21, 2011 Last: May 20, 2013 |
I'd just like to counter a lot of the arguments raised about this pipeline. First, there are 10's of thousands of miles of oil, gas, etanol and CO2 pipelines traversing this country. Pipelines are an efficient and cheap way to move petroleum products-much better than trains or trucks. This pipeline would bring petroleum from Canada, our friendly neighbor to the north, to our country. It would reduce our energy dependence on oil from conflict sources, such as the Middle East, Venezuela etc. The pipeline would mean thousands of high paying jobs, that would contribute tax dollars to our economy. Oil from the Northern plain states would have an "on ramp" onto the pipeline. Unfortunately, Obama would much rather NOT want us to develop domestic oil sources. ":Green Energy" while admirable is still decades away from practicallity. |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at March 30, 2012 3:28 PM EDT
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Posts: 12532
First: February 29, 2008 Last: May 17, 2013 |
In Response to The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: I'd just like to counter a lot of the arguments raised about this pipeline. First, there are 10's of thousands of miles of oil, gas, etanol and CO2 pipelines traversing this country. Pipelines are an efficient and cheap way to move petroleum products-much better than trains or trucks. This pipeline would bring petroleum from Canada, our friendly neighbor to the north, to our country. It would reduce our energy dependence on oil from conflict sources, such as the Middle East, Venezuela etc. The pipeline would mean thousands of high paying jobs, that would contribute tax dollars to our economy. Oil from the Northern plain states would have an "on ramp" onto the pipeline. Unfortunately, Obama would much rather NOT want us to develop domestic oil sources. ":Green Energy" while admirable is still decades away from practicallity. Posted by Labrat64 Bill Clinton says in POLITICO -----BLAME the system’s builder, , TransCanada, for the fact that it hasn’t been built yet. One of the most amazing things to me about this Keystone pipeline deal is that they ever filed that route in the first place, since they could have gone around the Nebraska Sandhills and avoided most of the dangers, no matter how imagined, to the Ogallala [aquifer] with a different route,” |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at March 31, 2012 11:29 PM EDT
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Posts: 531
First: August 9, 2011 Last: May 19, 2013 |
If you think that this pipeline is going to lower the price of oil you better think again. The only reason the Canadians are squeezing oil from rock is because the price is high enough for them to do it. The days of cheap oil is over and we better start looking for other sources of energy because oil is just going to keep on climbing the scarcer it gets. If you think this pipeline is going to do a lot of good you are listening to theses Republicans too much. n Response to The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: I'd just like to counter a lot of the arguments raised about this pipeline. First, there are 10's of thousands of miles of oil, gas, etanol and CO2 pipelines traversing this country. Pipelines are an efficient and cheap way to move petroleum products-much better than trains or trucks. This pipeline would bring petroleum from Canada, our friendly neighbor to the north, to our country. It would reduce our energy dependence on oil from conflict sources, such as the Middle East, Venezuela etc. The pipeline would mean thousands of high paying jobs, that would contribute tax dollars to our economy. Oil from the Northern plain states would have an "on ramp" onto the pipeline. Unfortunately, Obama would much rather NOT want us to develop domestic oil sources. ":Green Energy" while admirable is still decades away from practicallity. Posted by Labrat64 |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at April 1, 2012 7:46 PM EDT
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Posts: 471
First: December 21, 2011 Last: May 20, 2013 |
In Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: If you think that this pipeline is going to lower the price of oil you better think again. The only reason the Canadians are squeezing oil from rock is because the price is high enough for them to do it. The days of cheap oil is over and we better start looking for other sources of energy because oil is just going to keep on climbing the scarcer it gets. If you think this pipeline is going to do a lot of good you are listening to theses Republicans too much. n Response to The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence : Posted by creppelrm The price of oil produced by this technology is <$80/barrel. Brent crude is currently ~$120/barrel. Much of the East Coast relies on gasoline and heating oil pegged to the much higher price of Brent. The cheapest gasoline is available in the Plains States. We do not have any energy policy at all. What we should be doing is developing all of our energy resources-meaning oil, methane, coal and nuclear. This will put us on the path of energy independence along with providing millions of much needed jobs. While solar and wind can make a contribution, it will take decades before this happens. We shouldn't be throwing away Billions of tax dollars on the likes of Solyndra and other "Green" energy producers. Such development should be left to private industry. Government is too big! |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at April 2, 2012 2:11 AM EDT
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Posts: 531
First: August 9, 2011 Last: May 19, 2013 |
If you call 3.45 a gallon gasoline cheap you hit the mega lottery last Friday and gasoline is not getting any cheaper. And will not get any cheaper no matter how much we drill here. The days of cheap gasoline is over. If you think we can live off coal and oil produced here in the U.S. you are only kidding yourself. Those were the days, we have to look for other sources besides fossil fuels that are also damaging the environment. What you are saying is for NOW not for the future. There is other sources and it will be found. Necessity is the mother of invention. The Chinese are investing heavily into what you call green energy. That was always what set the U.S. apart from the rest of the world. We always invented better ways of doing things. We can't let them get the jump on that issue because of Big Oil want us to depend on them only. If we had another source you would see the price of gasoline drop dramatically. n Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: In Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence : The price of oil produced by this technology is <$80/barrel. Brent crude is currently ~$120/barrel. Much of the East Coast relies on gasoline and heating oil pegged to the much higher price of Brent. The cheapest gasoline is available in the Plains States. We do not have any energy policy at all. What we should be doing is developing all of our energy resources-meaning oil, methane, coal and nuclear. This will put us on the path of energy independence along with providing millions of much needed jobs. While solar and wind can make a contribution, it will take decades before this happens. We shouldn't be throwing away Billions of tax dollars on the likes of Solyndra and other "Green" energy producers. Such development should be left to private industry. Government is too big! Posted by Labrat64 |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at April 2, 2012 11:53 AM EDT
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Posts: 12532
First: February 29, 2008 Last: May 17, 2013 |
In Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: If you think that this pipeline is going to lower the price of oil you better think again. The only reason the Canadians are squeezing oil from rock is because the price is high enough for them to do it. The days of cheap oil is over and we better start looking for other sources of energy because oil is just going to keep on climbing the scarcer it gets. If you think this pipeline is going to do a lot of good you are listening to theses Republicans too much. n Response to The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence : Posted by creppelrm Too bad so many American are fooled by those with special interests. We all should investigate more....and if we did we could find that Germany for example has big plans to eliminate nuke power plants by 2014 replacing them with wind and solar. Most homes throughout Germany have solar panels on their roofs already. A big factor in the continuing growth of the German economy is that during the Great Recession German workers never saw layoffs or significant reductions in pay. This is because all German corporations are required to have a board of directors comprised 50% of workers, and that during the financial crisis the German government filled in the pay gaps of workers working fewer hours. Thus demand never dropped in the German economy, because workers always had a good paycheck, and so their economy continues to be robust. The higher-than-expected growth was due to strong exports, helped by a weaker euro. |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at April 2, 2012 7:49 PM EDT
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Posts: 471
First: December 21, 2011 Last: May 20, 2013 |
In Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: If you call 3.45 a gallon gasoline cheap you hit the mega lottery last Friday and gasoline is not getting any cheaper. And will not get any cheaper no matter how much we drill here. The days of cheap gasoline is over. If you think we can live off coal and oil produced here in the U.S. you are only kidding yourself. Those were the days, we have to look for other sources besides fossil fuels that are also damaging the environment. What you are saying is for NOW not for the future. There is other sources and it will be found. Necessity is the mother of invention. The Chinese are investing heavily into what you call green energy. That was always what set the U.S. apart from the rest of the world. We always invented better ways of doing things. We can't let them get the jump on that issue because of Big Oil want us to depend on them only. If we had another source you would see the price of gasoline drop dramatically. n Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence : Posted by creppelrm We have no energy policy, period. Obama stated that we have an "all the above" policy when it comes to energy production. That turns out to be an out and out lie. All forms of fossil fuel have been demonized. Any increase in the exploration and drilling for oil and natural gas was done under Bush and is coming to fruition now. Its being done on state and private lands. Obama has sharply curtailed oil production on both coasts and in Alaska. Permits issued are down sharply. The goal of the EPA is to eliminate coal, which supplies over 40% of our electricity, In place of these sources of energy we have solar which is not very efficient (only limited wavelengths can be used) and wind, whose turbines tend to shred passing birds. What we should be doing is using methane, which is plentyful in North america, as a transportation fuel. It's already used in many fleet vehicles. Instead of acting as venture capitalists (and very poor ones at that) we should be funding research programs that help us maximise our resources. That would be far less costly than throwing away tax dollars on "Green Energy" companies that are not economically viable. |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at April 3, 2012 12:00 AM EDT
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Posts: 531
First: August 9, 2011 Last: May 19, 2013 |
Methane burns but burns dirty like the other fuels. Natural gas burns clean and the oil companies are burning tons of the gas off shore because they want the oil instead of the gas. When I say tons of the gas you wouldn't believe how much they are wasting off the coast of Africa and around the world. One flair alone you cannot get within half a mile of it for it being so hot. There are hundreds of the flairs burhing day and night. One day our descendents will look back at the world that we wasted and the world they could have had. n Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: In Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence : We have no energy policy, period. Obama stated that we have an "all the above" policy when it comes to energy production. That turns out to be an out and out lie. All forms of fossil fuel have been demonized. Any increase in the exploration and drilling for oil and natural gas was done under Bush and is coming to fruition now. Its being done on state and private lands. Obama has sharply curtailed oil production on both coasts and in Alaska. Permits issued are down sharply. The goal of the EPA is to eliminate coal, which supplies over 40% of our electricity, In place of these sources of energy we have solar which is not very efficient (only limited wavelengths can be used) and wind, whose turbines tend to shred passing birds. What we should be doing is using methane, which is plentyful in North america, as a transportation fuel. It's already used in many fleet vehicles. Instead of acting as venture capitalists (and very poor ones at that) we should be funding research programs that help us maximise our resources. That would be far less costly than throwing away tax dollars on "Green Energy" companies that are not economically viable. Posted by Labrat64 |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at April 3, 2012 7:55 AM EDT
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Posts: 471
First: December 21, 2011 Last: May 20, 2013 |
Methane (CH4) is the same as natural gas, although natural gas contains small quantities of some lower molecular weight alkanes and alkenes such as ethane, ethylene and propane. As a chemist, that was in the field for over 40 years before I retired, I can tell you that Obama and his tree hugging supporters have no idea about what they are talking about when it comes to energy. In Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: Methane burns but burns dirty like the other fuels. Natural gas burns clean and the oil companies are burning tons of the gas off shore because they want the oil instead of the gas. When I say tons of the gas you wouldn't believe how much they are wasting off the coast of Africa and around the world. One flair alone you cannot get within half a mile of it for it being so hot. There are hundreds of the flairs burhing day and night. One day our descendents will look back at the world that we wasted and the world they could have had. n Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence : Posted by creppelrm |
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Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
posted at April 3, 2012 10:00 AM EDT
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Posts: 531
First: August 9, 2011 Last: May 19, 2013 |
In Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence: Methane (CH4) is the same as natural gas, although natural gas contains small quantities of some lower molecular weight alkanes and alkenes such as ethane, ethylene and propane. As a chemist, that was in the field for over 40 years before I retired, I can tell you that Obama and his tree hugging supporters have no idea about what they are talking about when it comes to energy. In Response to Re: The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence : Posted by Labrat64 |
Forums » Politics & Society » Government & Elections » The Keystone XL Pipeline and US Energy Independence
